Greg Fischer shows some of the signs — both visible and invisible to the eye — of a political leader who has spent over a decade in office as Louisville's mayor.There are a few more gray hairs, some additional wrinkles and countless valuable and tough experiences lived through after winning election in 2010 and preparing to leave office now as 2022 ends.But sitting down with The Courier Journal for an interview inside Metro Hall on Monday morning, Fischer, 64, said he had no second thoughts about serving for three terms. And the Democrat offered introspection on his time in office, his achievements and on Louisville's future.Here's what Fischer said, with some responses edited for length and clarity.How do you describe your third and final term, and would you describe it as the most challenging of the three?"Well, it was definitely the most challenging term. I mean, when you think about the fact that we're in a once-in-a-century global pandemic and then twice-a-century racial justice protests happening at the same time, and I was president of the U.S. Conference of Mayors also in (President Donald) Trump's last six months in office, and he was really coming after cities, so kind of defending the mayors of America during all that was a really difficult time. I'm glad our administration was in office at that point in time, because it requires a lot of experience to navigate a city through something like that. They were unprecedented challenges, and I think now that it's gone by, it was super intense obviously while we were in it, the loss of the lives of Breonna Taylor and Tyler Gerth and David McAtee were horrible, but what we showed as a city was we can get through something very difficult."There were four cities that were really in the hot spot then. It was Minneapolis, Seattle and Portland and Louisville. We've emerged much stronger and quicker than any of those cities have, so I'm really proud of our city, and I'm proud of the way protesters have gotten involved with the administration and on boards to help us move toward process improvement and not just protest as well. And the police learned during all that process too how to deescalate. You know, we've never been through anything like that as a city before, so we were all learning together, and I think history will show we did a commendable job with something that was very, very challenging."Timeline:Notable events during Greg Fischer's tenure as Louisville mayor: A timelineDid family or friends try to dissuade you from running again for a third term, or was there any point during the past two years when things were getting really chaotic that you had loved ones saying, "I wish you hadn't run again?""I mean a lot of people just said why would you go through all that grief and all that criticism because, you know, people were trying to exert a lot of pressure on that time to make quick decisions, and I knew that was not the right thing to do because these were very complicated issues that were going to take investigations to really understand what took place, and that was the only way that justice would be rendered, and so, to interfere with that in any way, I felt, was not the right thing to do. Our police officers deserve due process, and the community deserved the truth, and that doesn't come quickly. But we're living in a time obviously where people want things like this (snaps fingers) and they think they know what's going on and should be done, and obviously what people thought should have been done quickly in the heat of the moment would have been the wrong thing to do, and time has shown us that."We got things done in the third term that we couldn't have gotten done in the first eight years, in particular, the funding of the Evolve502 Scholarship, so I think that will be one of the things that will go down as one of our top five or top 10 accomplishments. ...The reason that's important is the main cause of problems that come into this office are due to poverty, and the number one disruptor of poverty is an education, either a degree or a credential, so now, nobody in the community can say, 'We can't afford to send our kids to college or get a credential.' That took 10, 11 years to get done. So that wouldn't have happened in the eight years, or the massive investments we've made in affordable housing in this term as well. So in retrospect, I'm really glad that we were in office for 12 years. It was tough in that time, but that shaped our city and certainly shaped our country as well.""That's something that everybody's got to recognize, that the whole country has been going through their own version of this. It's a tough time in America right now. ... We're not being bombed by Russia. We don't have a famine going on like Somalia, but Americans say they're unhappy, so I think it's time for some introspection about where we're at, what we have and how we can work together."Do you think your accomplishments were, at times, overshadowed by Breonna Taylor's death or the pandemic and all these sorts of challenges, and did it ever feel like, no matter what you did, it would draw criticism from residents?Fischer: "Oh, absolutely. I can remember vividly having two meetings back to back where one meeting, an irate group was saying, 'Our protesters are out of control. Our city will never recover from this, You need to crack down on the protesters.' And the next meeting would be a group of people saying, 'Our police officers are out of control. You need to defund the police.' That snapshot was what that whole period was like. You had strong feelings on both sides. My job, I felt like, was to get our city through that somehow, just keep following the truth and keep going down the path of accountability. That's just one small snapshot."For subscribers:From boutique hotels to a gaming venue, 4 downtown Louisville developments to watch in 2023"I knew all the local protesters, and they knew me, and we worked together before, so we could talk easily back and forth. It was some of the out-of-the-town groups that came in that made things particularly difficult, especially here in our state, it's legal to walk down Main Street with an assault rifle, so managing these weekend activities where you had scores of people, and you had to give them their dedicated space to exercise free speech, and they had to see each other, so you had two opposing views. We had white nationalists, Black nationalists, both with assault rifles, over 100 each, and they're looking at each other and somehow trying to keep that safe while there's dozens of other things going on as well. That's difficult, especially when you're in say, day 80 of the protests, and everybody's exhausted — protesters, police, our administration. And I'm very thankful in retrospect that there was just not more mayhem than what took place."So that was a time where we went into almost 100% reactive mode. To have a great mayor's office, you have to be really good at reacting to problems but then you've got to keep working your strategy. You have to have proactive skills ... scholarships, affordable housing, Bourbonism and all these other activities. ...The pandemic compared to the protests in that time was much easier to manage because there was one clear objective — beat the pandemic. Nobody disagreed with that. During the protests, we had all these different points of view, so no matter what it was, 50% of people were going to be behind it."How much responsibility do you take or feel for some of the violence in recent years, in terms of homicides reaching this record high number?"In July 2020, here and all over America, boom. Homicides started skyrocketing. So, why? Guns are everywhere. It's interesting to me when people talk about guns, they don't say why are there so many guns on the streets of America? The state legislature in my view has been totally irresponsible in allowing guns to be issued to practically anybody, including assault rifles. And then they want to be critical about gun violence while they're providing the guns. It's like an arsonist pretending to be a firefighter. There needs to be accountability at these levels of the provision of so many weapons, basically unfettered, on the streets of America. So that didn't help, and then of course you had all the other issues of 2020, with police officers pulling back after they saw what happened with the George Floyd incident. Then we had to monitor the protests that were going on, so that was here in Louisville and all over America. Now, fortunately, homicides are down about 15% this year, shootings are down about 33% but still way too high. We've made good progress, and we're investing in not just the law enforcement side but the prevention and intervention. That's the key going forward.""You just can't say, 'We need more police officers.' If that was effective, we'd already be in good shape. The police show up after the fact. It's before the fact when you've got to have intervention and prevention, family responsibility and the community taking their responsibility, saying when they see the shooter and know the shooter, they need to be able to report that and feel they can do that safely."This year, this increase we've had in domestic violence is unusual. It's about 15% of our homicides this year. Normally, it's around 5% or 7%. So you've got that, and then the other thing that's happened over the last five years in particular is the shootings that take place because of social media beefs. When I started as mayor, social media was you sharing pictures with your friends. Now it's just totally out of control, and so people start beefing on that, and because guns are everywhere, they solve that by shooting and oftentimes it leads to homicides. We know our gang situation much better than we did before. ...I just really hope the next administration continues with this kind of whole-of-city approach and whole-of-government approach to funding, investing and reducing homicides, because overall crime is down, but these 'headline crimes' are what's up."Do you think LMPD is in a better spot now versus when you took office?"Well, it's a totally different environment. One is all the guns that are on the streets ... and then 2020 was extraordinarily difficult, not just on our citizens but on LMPD as well. When you have this once-every-50-years kind of protest activity, the police forces of America really were not trained for these mass demonstrations and so it's a totally different skill that's required for them, and all of a sudden, they're going from riding their beats to being on a protest line, people spitting on them, throwing urine and feces on them, saying everything possible, and talking to our police officers, it was like, what happened? All of a sudden (they) were these villains because they represent an institution and so that led to quite a few police officers leaving the profession. We're down about 250, 300 from our authorized force right now. Fortunately, the trend is starting to go back up now, so I'm thankful for that, but it was really hard on them, so we're in a really different place is what I would say ... particularly here because of the high-profile killing of Breonna Taylor and the way we've responded to that."I said, let's do a top-to-bottom review of the police department. Hillard Heintze came up with a lot of great recommendations, noticed our assets, but some people think that shows we're weak. No, audits show we're strong, because every agency has some areas to improve, and what's bad is if you don't go and find out and audit what's wrong. It's a time of uncertainty obviously. The Department of Justice investigation is taking place right now. Fortunately, we're way ahead of where that's going with the Hillard Heintze review. And we know we're in the process of searching for a police chief, which the mayor-elect intends to do. That puts some uncertainty in the police force also."For subscribers:JCPS is going to revisit its reading instruction — but internal discord threatens changeWhen somebody punched you at Fourth Street Live, did any family or close friends come to you and say again, "I wish you would end this job or not have to put up with this at this point?""Not really. At that point, I'm 11 1/2 years into (being) mayor. The country has totally changed. It's like, nothing surprises me. Some guy walks out of nowhere and sucker punches you. It's like, 'OK. It's another day in the mayor's office.' Fortunately, I did not get hurt seriously, and I bounced right back up, so as I joked, I'm glad to see I can still take a punch at 64 years old, but it's really unfortunate. You see kidnapping plots on governors. You see school board meetings descending into mayhem. ... It's like, we've got to be real introspective as a country about where are we going and why are we going there. You've got to kind of pull it back together if we expect to leave a better country for our kids and our grandkids."What things do you regret or would try to do differently when you look back at the 12 years?"Well, the areas that have been most high profile in terms of challenges have been with the police department, to the corrections department to some degree, and I relied on audits and national accreditation to kind of say, OK, we're on the right track...(but) these accreditations are not going deep enough to really get down into the process issues. For instance, with LMPD, the search warrant process that ultimately was the weak link with the Breonna Taylor death. Do you go down to that level and understand that when multiple signs off are required, would that have prevented anything? We're never going to know.""I wish there were more robust accreditation processes out there. I wish I knew that at the time as well, and then, this is big city we have, 400 square miles. I've tried to be everywhere and balance it with the time I spent in the office on strategy development, and I am kind of known as the people's mayor because I'm everywhere, but I wish I could have been more places as well. I really get good energy off of interacting with our citizens."What do you hope your legacy is as mayor?"I hope what people see is the city has gone through an incredible renaissance in these 12 years and we've showed that we can experience a tragedy and get through that, and get through it much more quickly than anybody thought possible in terms of the economic and tourism rebound, which are now beyond where they were before then. I never want to discount the pain to the families of Breonna and Tyler and David McAtee. That's first and foremost. Unfortunately in life, when a tragedy happens, triumphs happen, and you're measured I think about how you can pull out of tragedy.""I really emphasize us being a more global city, because I think it's important our kids grow up in a city that looks like the world, because they're going to be global citizens, so (immigrants) have produced almost 35% of our population growth, and (that) makes us a much more interesting and entrepreneurial and culturally dynamic city as well."Does Louisville have a strong identity? What would you say it is?"Our emergence and recognition on the global scene is much higher than it was 12 years ago, and everything from Muhammad Ali's passing and our celebration of the The Champ, five-time international model city of compassion, Bourbonism, our place with wellness and aging and innovation ... we're seen as a much more dynamic and inclusive city, that makes me proud as well, because we've got to be a global city, and we're rapidly becoming one."More:Cameron: JCPS board broke open meetings law by barring unmasked man from public meetingDo you talk to former mayors, such as Mayor Jerry Abramson, whether that's for advice or simply catching up?Fischer: "My last meeting with Jerry was probably four months or so ago. We had a lunch, and I just wanted to pick his brain about transitions and how he thought about transitioning out of the mayor's office and any advice, because he went quickly into the lieutenant governor type of gig, so he had a different path going forward form what I'll have."With Craig Greenberg preparing to take office, what are your hopes or expectations for him?"I've known him a long time. He was a supporter of my campaigns, and he's a business person like I was, so we've had a great relationship over the years, and each one of our departments prepared a transition book so they can get up to speed very quickly on that, and of course, he and I have regular conversations as well. One of the important things is you got to know what you don't know because I call being a mayor the essential worker of American politics because it's so immediate, things are happening. So are you clear on what your strategy is? Do you know how can do what within an administration and how you can react while you keep the plan going? So it's a lot ... (and) fortunately we've got a great team, so hopefully he'll assess all his strengths and weaknesses and build on those in his own unique way."What's next for you?"I'm going to take a pause ... just to digest everything. I'm going on a retreat in the month of April just to reflect and write, and I'll be traveling here and there. I retired once at an early age, and I was not happy at all. I like being busy, and I like making a difference, and I was able to do that before with businesses, and I just thought it would be a wonderful way to serve, to see if you could use a city as a platform for human potential to flourish. That's our whole model and definition of compassion. So that will be the driver for the rest of my life, is to see where I can make a difference in scale to help people, so I'll be assessing that over the next six to 12 months or so."What is your family looking forward to in terms of having you around a bit more?"If you're all in as a mayor like I am ... it's a 16-, 18-hour-a-day job, so literally you schedule when you're going to see your granddaughters (Fischer has two grandkids along with four children), and if it's not on the schedule, it's not going to happen ... it's very restrictive in that sense, so to have a lot more time to hang out and just see them grow and share love with them, I'm looking forward to that."Reach Billy Kobin at [email protected]

As Louisville Mayor Greg Fischer wraps up his third and final term, here is a timeline of some of the more notable moments in his tenure.Nov. 2, 2010 — Fischer wins first electionFischer defeats Republican Hal Heiner to become the second-ever mayor of the merged city-county government. "We celebrate a future in which we create the best city government in the nation," said Fischer, an entrepreneur and investor who promised to create more jobs.Jan. 3, 2011 — InaugurationSpeaking on the steps of the old county courthouse, now known as Metro Hall, Fischer describes the city's core values as health, compassion and lifelong learning.March 20, 2012 — LMPD Chief Steve Conrad takes chargeAfter Louisville Metro Police Chief Robert C. White leaves for Denver, Colorado, Fischer picks ex-Glendale, Arizona, police Chief Steve Conrad for the top LMPD job.March 2013 — Sustain Louisville beginsFischer creates Sustain Louisville, the city's first-ever sustainability plan. He would later update Louisville's sustainability-related goals, including signing a 2022 executive order to designate 2040 as the community-wide goal for net zero emissions.Aug. 21, 2014 — 'Bourbonism' boom in LouisvilleA Courier Journal story notes the increasing number of distilleries in Louisville, particularly along Main Street. "I think we're just in the very, very early stages of seeing what it's going to be," Fischer said, describing the growth of distilleries and resulting gains in employment, taxes and tourism as "bourbonism," a term he and others would use throughout his term as the bourbon-fueled renaissance continued.Jan. 5, 2015 — Fischer sworn in after winning second termAfter coasting to victory over Republican candidate Bob DeVore, Fischer pledges during his second inaugural address to invest more in the city to make it "even more inclusive, entrepreneurial, economically competitive and globally oriented."June 3, 2016 — Muhammad Ali diesLegendary boxer Muhammad Ali, a Louisville native, dies in Scottsdale, Arizona, after a decadeslong fight with Parkinson's disease. Fischer and a host of government, public and private organizations work together in the hours and days following Ali's death to prepare for a funeral, a procession and numerous events in honor of The Champ, with the city in the national spotlight.Aug. 17, 2016 — West Louisville FoodPort project canceledThe developer of the West Louisville FoodPort, a celebrated local food project that was a cornerstone of Fischer's West End redevelopment strategy, abruptly canceled the plan at 30th Street and Muhammad Ali Boulevard. The FoodPort project primarily fell apart after a key proposal, calling for a $23 million indoor vertical farm, is withdrawn.Oct. 28, 2016 — Walmart drops plans for West End storeMore than two years after announcing it would spend over $25 million to bring a superstore to the old Phillip Morris site by West Broadway and 18th Street in the retail-starved West End, Walmart stuns city leaders by canceling the plans. Fischer said a preservation-minded lawsuit from a "very small group of citizens" doomed the deal.Dec. 31, 2016 — Louisville ends year with record homicide countThe year 2016 sees a record 123 homicides in Jefferson County, with 117 investigated by Louisville Metro Police. The following year, 2017, would see 102 homicides, continuing a trend for a city that saw 48 criminal homicides in 2011, the year Fischer took office.March 13, 2017 — Fischer shuts down LMPD Explorer programFischer shuts down the Louisville Metro Police Explorer Scout program, which was intended to introduce youths to law enforcement careers, because of a sexual abuse scandal involving officers. Days later, Fischer would hire former U.S. Attorney Kerry Harvey to investigate LMPD's handling of the sex abuse allegations, which Fischer said he did not learn about until October 2016.In 2017, Chief Conrad says in a deposition that he briefed Deputy Mayor Ellen Hesen in 2013 and 2014 about allegations of sexual misconduct in the Explorer program. In 2021, the city agrees to pay $3.65 million to seven former scouts who said they were sexually abused.Oct. 19, 2017 — YMCA groundbreakingFischer joins officials and residents at a groundbreaking ceremony for the new Republic Bank Foundation YMCA by West Broadway and 18th Street. The facility, which opened in December 2019, provides a vital fitness, health, education and community resource in a part of the city that has suffered from disinvestment and vacant properties.Nov. 6, 2018 — Fischer wins third termFischer defeats Republican Angela Leet to win a third and final term in office. “I promise the people of Louisville: We are just getting started," Fischer says at his election night party. "Our city today has momentum and opportunity like none of us has ever seen in our lifetime. And now, we have to do more to make sure everybody is along for the ride."December 2019 — Fischer chosen to lead U.S. Conference of MayorsFischer is picked to serve as president of the nonpartisan U.S. Conference of Mayors. He takes over in June 2020, serving for one year during a critical time for Louisville and other cities amid the COVID-19 pandemic and protests over the police killings of Breonna Taylor in Louisville and George Floyd in Minneapolis.March 2020 — COVID-19 Pandemic hitsThe COVID-19 pandemic emerges, closing schools, businesses, restaurants and countless other things in Louisville to close or shift to virtual operations. Fischer would begin giving regular updates to the city in an effort to control the spread of the virus, and more than 2,500 people in Jefferson County would suffer COVID-related deaths in the worldwide pandemic.March 13, 2020 — Breonna Taylor diesBreonna Taylor, a 26-year-old Black woman, dies after LMPD officers shoot her during a botched drug raid at her South End apartment. Officers opened fire after Taylor's boyfriend, Kenneth Walker, fired a shot at what he said he thought were intruders busting down the apartment's front door. No drugs or money were found in Taylor's home.May 28, 2020 — Mass protests begin over Breonna Taylor's deathThe first mass protest over Taylor's killing begins near Sixth and Jefferson streets in downtown Louisville. The timing is related to the police killing a few days earlier of George Floyd in Minneapolis and earlier that day of The Courier Journal obtaining audio from Walker's frantic, emotional 911 call following the shooting at Taylor's apartment.Fischer implements a 9 p.m. curfew for the first few nights of demonstrations, but the protests in Louisville would continue each day and night for over 100 days. A Jefferson County grand jury in September 2020 indicted one of the officers who fired during the raid at Taylor's home but for bullets that flew into an occupied, neighboring apartment, rather than at Taylor. That officer, Brett Hankison, would be found not guilty in March 2022 at the conclusion of a trial. But in August 2022, the U.S. Department of Justice announces federal indictments of Hankison and three other former LMPD personnel on charges mainly related to lying on the search warrant obtained for Taylor's apartment.Breonna Taylor shooting:A 2-year timeline shows how her death resulted in changeJune 1, 2020 — Police kill David McAtee, Fischer fires ConradWith the city on edge, David "YaYa" McAtee, a beloved BBQ chef in the West End, is killed after Kentucky National Guard and LMPD personnel shoot at him, with an investigation later determining the fatal shot came from a National Guard member. The National Guard was in Louisville to assist with the response to the nightly protests.Fischer fires Conrad after learned the LMPD officers at the scene of McAtee's shooting did not have their body cameras turned on.June 2, 2020 — Fischer goes to protesters on streets to defend himselfFischer goes to Jefferson Square Park, the hub of protests, to speak with demonstrators for the first time about racial inequality, police brutality and his handling of Taylor's death. When protesters ask why the three officers who fired their weapons in the Taylor incident can't immediately be arrested and prosecuted, Fischer says state law limits what he can do because officers "have rights" to an investigation.July 12, 2020 — LouCity plays first match at new soccer stadiumLynn Family Stadium, the $65 million soccer-specific stadium, hosts its first Louisville City FC game before a pandemic-limited crowd of nearly 5,000. Fischer said in 2017 that the city would use $25 million to buy the land for the soccer stadium that can seat over 11,500 and expand to 15,000-plus spectators and would contribute another $5 million for infrastructure improvements. The stadium is also home to Racing Louisville FC,Sept. 15, 2020 — City settles with Taylor's family for $12 millionAttorneys for Taylor's family and city officials announce a record-breaking $12 million settlement for her family that includes a host of police reforms. "Breonna was loved," Fischer said. "I cannot begin to imagine Ms. Palmer's (Taylor's mother, Tamika Palmer) pain, and I am deeply, deeply sorry for Breonna's death."Jan. 19, 2021 — Erika Shields sworn in as new LMPD chiefAfter a tumultuous period of two interim chiefs following Conrad's firing and the 2020 protests, Erika Shields is sworn in as LMPD's leader, becoming the city's second female and first openly gay chief. She is described by Fischer as “a special kind of leader."February 2021 — Track and field complex opens in the West EndThe Norton Healthcare Sports & Learning Center, a $53 million facility, opens at 30th Street and Muhammad Ali Boulevard, the corner where the FoodPort project fell through. Complete with two tracks, a rock-climbing wall, a mini bowling alley, a classroom with a dozen tables and a Thornton's store, the new center hosts various track and field events featuring youth, collegiate and professional runners. The city chipped in $10 million to help open the center.Dec. 31, 2021 — Louisville homicide record broken in back-to-back yearsLouisville sees 211 total homicides in 2021 after seeing a record 187 killings in 2020.June 18, 2022 — Fischer punched at Fourth Street LiveFischer is punched near the neck and shoulder by a man during an event at Fourth Street Live downtown. Though knocked over by the blow, Fischer suffers no serious injuries, and police later charge the man with fourth-degree assault.July 21, 2022 — Residents begin returning to Beecher TerraceResidents begin moving back into Beecher Terrace, the public housing complex west of Ninth Street that was built in 1939 and demolished in 2017 to make way for new, mixed-income apartments. Once complete, the revitalized development will feature 448 affordable apartments, 172 market-rate apartments and 20 single-family houses. The project is part of the Fischer administration's over $200 million neighborhood-wide redevelopment process, which includes investments throughout the Russell neighborhood.Oct. 25, 2022 — Fischer's father, George, diesGeorge Fischer, the mayor's Father and an entrepreneur who left his mark on Louisville in several ways, dies at the age of 90. Before earning a place in the Kentucky Entrepreneur Hall of Fame in 2013, he started Metridata Computer Inc., which the organization said became "one of the largest remote computer processing companies in the Midwest" before he sold it in 1979, and later with his sons founded Servend International, which the University of Louisville noted went "from the brink of bankruptcy to being the largest maker of ice- and beverage-dispensing systems in the world.""He and my Mom taught and showed me and my siblings that caring for others and leaving the world a better place are the best things anyone can accomplish," Mayor Fischer said.Nov. 8, 2022 — Greenberg wins election to succeed Fischer as mayorA businessman and lawyer with experience as a developer, Democratic candidate Craig Greenberg defeated Republican candidate and Jeffersontown Mayor Bill Dieruf in the November 2022 election to succeed Fischer as mayor of Louisville. Fischer congratulated Greenberg and tweeted that he looked "forward to working with him to ensure a smooth transition."Reach Billy Kobin at [email protected]